Racing for 3rd - Page 2

**Jocasta** · 03-17-2008, 10:27 AM

Eric, why do you hate Hamilton? He won a race, by your own admission, that was full of driver errors, which says how skillful he is.

Blackmask · 03-17-2008, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edawg99

I agree with you there BM, there where alot of driver errors but there just a bit rusty from the off season.

They've all been in testing for months. They haven't raced without the traction control and other driver assists though so that's something they'll all need to get used to.

edawg99 · 03-17-2008, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jocasta

Eric, why do you hate Hamilton? He won a race, by your own admission, that was full of driver errors, which says how skillful he is.

There is too much hype around him and they always make a big deal about him being the first black driver to do this and that. I'm tired of hearing it.

Blackmask · 03-18-2008, 03:12 AM

Maybe I've just missed it, but I haven't heard a single reference to him being black here. So much was that the case that I didn't even realise he was black until half way through the season when I saw him for the first time without his helmet. What I did hear was that he was a rookie doing amazing things in his first year and that deserved hype. He's still one of the youngest drivers and in only his second year still doing amazing things.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edawg99

There is too much hype around him and they always make a big deal about him being the first black driver to do this and that. I'm tired of hearing it.

Of course there's hype, because of what he's achieved at such a young age and as a rookie but any hype there is is not his making, seems harsh to hate the guy for something out his control.
As for being black, I can only talk about the UK but any hype here is because he's successful and British... being black isn't a big issue,* although it makes him a great role model.
Sorry, but he's the most exciting new driver in years, if you follow F1 you'll have to get used to him.

*But what does it matter if there is talk about him being black; he's the first black man to break through into F1, so why not celebrate that?

edawg99 · 03-18-2008, 11:17 AM

Well if they didn't make such a big deal about him being black it would be ok. Why can't they say he is just a good driver with a lot of talent. I admit he is a good driver but I'm not a fan. I'm routing for Kimi this year since I know my favourite driver Fernado doesn't have much of a chance to win with the Renault.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 11:42 AM

I've told you why people mentioned his colour but that was mostly at the start. I still don't see much press about his race, maybe you're looking for it.
Would it bother you so much if the first woman to do as well got a lot of press?

Captain Beefheart · 03-18-2008, 12:31 PM

KovalOWNED.

Hamilton was put into probably the best situation you could as a driver. Anyone who denies that is a moron and don't give all that "he earned his stripes" bs argument. I mean it's hard to not understand there's a hegemony btw McLaren and Ferrari and everyone else is racing for third. Put Hamilton on a Renault, would he have won back to back titles at age 23? Doubt it.

Hamilton throwing away the title was year was just an example of the ample differences as drivers. Lewis given the best car BOOOOOOOOOOOM off you go.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 12:36 PM

What are you saying Beefy, Hamilton isn't very good?

Yes or no, please.

Captain Beefheart · 03-18-2008, 12:51 PM

I'm not saying he's a bad driver, obviously if you get to this "level" it would be hard to argue he isn't, but with actions like Kovalainen's sometimes you can't fall on that argument.

What i'm saying with Ron's favor he was placed in probably the best situation you could as a driver. Would you deny that? I mean serious if he was racing a Toyota you think he would be getting poles and podiums left and right? Not really. The ultimate achievement as a driver is to make the most out of what you're given(ie: Senna in the late 80's) or hell even Alonso winning titles with a FRENCH "scuderia" and not only winning with Renault but pretty much retiring one of the legends of the circuit and showing versatility in every race under any condition given. That's the mark of a true champion. Not throwing a title away in two races.

If Alonso manages to be among the Top 5 all season, it would only cement his place as one of the top modern drivers. Renault was given about 6 months to come up with a competitive car and they have failed if the practice/qualifying tests are any indication. If life gives you tomatos, you can't expect cider juice.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 01:03 PM

Quote:

I'm not saying he's a bad driver

It would be ludicrous to suggest, given that McLaren want to win the title and would presumable have the pick of some of the very best drivers. Of course the car is a massive part of the team, ie driver & car, what percentage experts can argue over but to knock a rookie who did what Hamilton achieved smacks of petty jealously or bigotry (ie he's English

).
Alonso is a great driver, Senna was one of the greatest but they had years to prove that. Give Hamilton 10 years driving at the top and then see if we can call him great or not.
Personally I'm not that concerned who wins but to see you constantly attacking a man who's already proved so much is tiresome.

Captain Beefheart · 03-18-2008, 01:29 PM

What's he proven exactly? Throwing a title away with three races to go? Trying to punk Alonso who was making a move with a Peugeot and looking like a fool on turn 3 in Brasil?

Maybe we have different definitions and standards of what proving oneself is. For me he was placed in a "win win" situation and basically given a chance for a title on a silver plater. Really what's he done to be given a McLaren on his rookie season. He doesn't really have any previous background, did he race with Minardi and get results to even be considered for the position. Even Schumi drove with Jordan before being a legend.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 01:34 PM

Tiresome, petty. He got the job for whatever reason, presumably because he has talent... if you seriously think anyone could have done what he did, then you're more of a fool than I ever imagined.

Captain Beefheart · 03-18-2008, 01:46 PM

You are not arguing anything of merit and when you bring bigotry in it's perfectly clear you don't have anything of base. Are you one of those people who think inheriting a fortune takes talent, or maybe the tangent involves going bankrupt? HAHHAHA.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 02:19 PM

You are a silly boy, stop being antagonistic for the sake of it. What did Hamilton inherit that makes you so bitter?
Stop arguing with nothing but your jealousy and accept his success. But I know you won't praise his success even if he wins every GP for the next 3 seasons which is why I'm not discussing this with you any more. Silly sausage!

**Val** · 03-18-2008, 03:28 PM

MUMMY AND BEEF! PLEASE!!!

I'm going to my aunt's house in a few minutes.
Be nice you two while I'm out.

**Jocasta** · 03-18-2008, 03:39 PM

Don't fret, Val.

edawg99 · 03-19-2008, 12:26 AM

Well Hamilton choked big time last year, I think he will win the Championship this year but I hope not. He is a good driver with a good car but I agree with Beefy put him on another team and he wouldn't of accomplished as much as he did so soon.

**Jocasta** · 03-19-2008, 02:29 AM

Quote:

put him on another team and he wouldn't of accomplished as much as he did so soon.

Well duh! Hahaha

03-18-2008, 12:31 PM	#28 (permalink)
Captain Beefheart Mu nótahu Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: In a West End town, a dead end world Posts: 4,109 My Profile	KovalOWNED. Hamilton was put into probably the best situation you could as a driver. Anyone who denies that is a moron and don't give all that "he earned his stripes" bs argument. I mean it's hard to not understand there's a hegemony btw McLaren and Ferrari and everyone else is racing for third. Put Hamilton on a Renault, would he have won back to back titles at age 23? Doubt it. Hamilton throwing away the title was year was just an example of the ample differences as drivers. Lewis given the best car BOOOOOOOOOOOM off you go. Last edited by Captain Beefheart : 03-18-2008 at 12:35 PM.

03-18-2008, 12:51 PM	#30 (permalink)
Captain Beefheart Mu nótahu Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: In a West End town, a dead end world Posts: 4,109 My Profile	I'm not saying he's a bad driver, obviously if you get to this "level" it would be hard to argue he isn't, but with actions like Kovalainen's sometimes you can't fall on that argument. What i'm saying with Ron's favor he was placed in probably the best situation you could as a driver. Would you deny that? I mean serious if he was racing a Toyota you think he would be getting poles and podiums left and right? Not really. The ultimate achievement as a driver is to make the most out of what you're given(ie: Senna in the late 80's) or hell even Alonso winning titles with a FRENCH "scuderia" and not only winning with Renault but pretty much retiring one of the legends of the circuit and showing versatility in every race under any condition given. That's the mark of a true champion. Not throwing a title away in two races. If Alonso manages to be among the Top 5 all season, it would only cement his place as one of the top modern drivers. Renault was given about 6 months to come up with a competitive car and they have failed if the practice/qualifying tests are any indication. If life gives you tomatos, you can't expect cider juice. Last edited by Captain Beefheart : 03-18-2008 at 12:54 PM.

03-18-2008, 01:34 PM	#33 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	Tiresome, petty. He got the job for whatever reason, presumably because he has talent... if you seriously think anyone could have done what he did, then you're more of a fool than I ever imagined. Last edited by Jocasta : 03-18-2008 at 01:35 PM.

03-18-2008, 03:28 PM	#36 (permalink)
Val Gear Heads Moderator Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Brazil Posts: 8,156 My Profile	MUMMY AND BEEF! PLEASE!!! I'm going to my aunt's house in a few minutes. Be nice you two while I'm out. Last edited by Val : 03-18-2008 at 03:29 PM.

03-17-2008, 10:27 AM	#21 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	Eric, why do you hate Hamilton? He won a race, by your own admission, that was full of driver errors, which says how skillful he is.

03-18-2008, 03:12 AM	#24 (permalink)
Blackmask Protector of Inanity Join Date: May 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 6,158 My Profile	Maybe I've just missed it, but I haven't heard a single reference to him being black here. So much was that the case that I didn't even realise he was black until half way through the season when I saw him for the first time without his helmet. What I did hear was that he was a rookie doing amazing things in his first year and that deserved hype. He's still one of the youngest drivers and in only his second year still doing amazing things.

03-18-2008, 11:17 AM	#26 (permalink)
edawg99 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 8,583 My Profile	Well if they didn't make such a big deal about him being black it would be ok. Why can't they say he is just a good driver with a lot of talent. I admit he is a good driver but I'm not a fan. I'm routing for Kimi this year since I know my favourite driver Fernado doesn't have much of a chance to win with the Renault.

03-18-2008, 11:42 AM	#27 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	I've told you why people mentioned his colour but that was mostly at the start. I still don't see much press about his race, maybe you're looking for it. Would it bother you so much if the first woman to do as well got a lot of press?

03-18-2008, 12:36 PM	#29 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	What are you saying Beefy, Hamilton isn't very good? Yes or no, please.

03-18-2008, 01:29 PM	#32 (permalink)
Captain Beefheart Mu nótahu Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: In a West End town, a dead end world Posts: 4,109 My Profile	What's he proven exactly? Throwing a title away with three races to go? Trying to punk Alonso who was making a move with a Peugeot and looking like a fool on turn 3 in Brasil? Maybe we have different definitions and standards of what proving oneself is. For me he was placed in a "win win" situation and basically given a chance for a title on a silver plater. Really what's he done to be given a McLaren on his rookie season. He doesn't really have any previous background, did he race with Minardi and get results to even be considered for the position. Even Schumi drove with Jordan before being a legend.

03-18-2008, 01:46 PM	#34 (permalink)
Captain Beefheart Mu nótahu Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: In a West End town, a dead end world Posts: 4,109 My Profile	You are not arguing anything of merit and when you bring bigotry in it's perfectly clear you don't have anything of base. Are you one of those people who think inheriting a fortune takes talent, or maybe the tangent involves going bankrupt? HAHHAHA.

03-18-2008, 02:19 PM	#35 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	You are a silly boy, stop being antagonistic for the sake of it. What did Hamilton inherit that makes you so bitter? Stop arguing with nothing but your jealousy and accept his success. But I know you won't praise his success even if he wins every GP for the next 3 seasons which is why I'm not discussing this with you any more. Silly sausage!

03-18-2008, 03:39 PM	#37 (permalink)
Jocasta Love Charlie Babbitt Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Shaftesbury Avenue Posts: 18,617 My Profile	Don't fret, Val.

03-19-2008, 12:26 AM	#38 (permalink)
edawg99 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Canada Posts: 8,583 My Profile	Well Hamilton choked big time last year, I think he will win the Championship this year but I hope not. He is a good driver with a good car but I agree with Beefy put him on another team and he wouldn't of accomplished as much as he did so soon.

03-19-2008, 08:30 AM	#40 (permalink)
Blackmask Protector of Inanity Join Date: May 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 6,158 My Profile